Misc: Do money make YOU happy?

[Dreamer7000]

However, if you were stuck on a desert island and forced to become self-proficient, im sure you'd find ways of being happy without any involvement of money.

Probably yes, a lonely island can contain food, woods to make some tools out of or whatever you necessarily need to live.
But here, there's no food on the streets anymore, unless you go into a shop or steal it. There are no woods you can cut out without buying it first from the owner of the land it is on.
On an island, you only "steal" from nature, which will provide more, and only you will use the woods to stick with my example. If that would be available in this modern world, everyone would "steal" from nature, and it won't be able to produce enough for many people

If your just happy relaxing under the sun on a summers day, rolling your hands on the soft green grass beneath you, then evidently you dont.

You'd probably have to pay for being able to enjoy this soon too... since you can't really find "good quality" grass, only in mountains, or by lakes or whatever, which you have to pay for to get there too.

[Hell Knight]

Well, money not make me happy, but if I don't have that makes me unhappy [img]tongue.gif[/img] And yeah, you must pay for everything[air is not expection in China(fresh air in masks that is)] and for game companies you must pay it's acceptable imo. For the companies, if you don't pay you don't play(saw it in a game trailer), but it's redicilous that how much costs everything. I don't think you guys know, but Hungary is one of the most expensive countries. And the payment here's the least, so I don't get the "Hungarian system"

[mrwiseman]

IRT Dreamer(1): we need money for everything that exists

It's only normal, and fair. Money is a way to quantize something's relative value, whether it's the work of somebody offering a service to you, an object you want that cost other people's time and effort to create, a rare object with intrinsic value, etc.

Money is actually the fair thing. It would be unfair if you were forced to work and you weren't given your work's worth.


you have to pay to enter a beautiful park

The reason why this park is beautiful is that people use the money they charge on maintaining and improving it.


to have a picnic

The lands you want to have a picnic on have an owner, just like you own your home. He/she could keep it to him/herself, or he/she could rent it so you can enjoy them.


You can only have food if you buy it

Many people work very hard to make this food, would you not pay them for their work? How much would it cost YOU to produce that food? You probably would have to devote your time to just one type of food, and you wouldn't be able to do anything else in life. This way you can pay very little for all kinds of food while you do something else (and work in your speciality to earn money).


it do makes me happier when I have some to spend

As we say in Spain, money doesn't make happiness, it buys it done .

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Money makes you and your friends and loved ones happy if used properly. There's nothing bad or nasty about it, that's what commies would say. You're alive to have fun, and if Xenosaga 2 is fun enough, then it's worth buying.

Of course, there are other sources of happiness in life, and you can't truly master your purpose without exploiting them. Simple friendship will provide one kind of happiness money won't, plain and simple. That's not to say, however, that you can be entirely happy with that and without money. You probably need both, unless you're a rare bird that don't like fun stuff like games, computers, etc. and don't need useful stuff like homes, cars, etc.

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IRT Cata: People often criticize money as being the source of all evil

These are usually the ones that don't have it ^_^ . Money is a good thing; you can get greedy and stupid with it which is not nice but that's not currency's fault, just like getting obese is not food's fault.


Without it [...] i imagine being happy would be harder too

Surely. Think how in the middle ages the lower class people would work their ass off just to have something to eat, while now they have to work less and even the lowest salaries will be enough to buy extra stuff besides food, like TVs, other electronics, and today's home equipment only nobles had in the past.

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IRT Dreamer(2): a lonely island can contain food, woods to make some tools out of or whatever you necessarily need to live

But how much would you have to work to get all that done, and how many jobs would you be doing? Would you have weekends and vacations? With our system, you only work in something you like, for a limited amount of time, then go outside, exchange a portion of your work's worth for bits of hundreds of other people's work, and do whatever you want with the rest, like buying fancy furniture you wouldn't have in a deserted island.


But here, there's no food on the streets anymore, unless you go into a shop or steal it.

It's not efficient to have the fields in cities. Would you like to have to walk 4 Km to get to your friend? Part of the money you pay goes to transportation, so you can have everything in the same place.


There are no woods you can cut out without buying it first from the owner of the land it is on.

Everything belongs to somebody. It's part of civilization. If you wanted to chop trees in a city, how would you deal with others who want the same wood? And how long would these trees last? The days of tribal wars and fighting your friends to get a chunk of meat ended thousands of years ago in Europe. Now we have something fair and peaceful going on.


On an island, you only "steal" from nature

Actually, you steal from the owner of the island, or, if none, the State (i.e. everyone).


everyone would "steal" from nature

And you'd be in eternal rivalry with everybody else. Besides, natural resources are limited. If everyone starts wanting some, without measuring their value with money, we'd run out of everything. Finally, primary resources are rarely needed. You sure don't want to pick rocks and make glass yourself, do you?


You'd probably have to pay for being able to enjoy this soon too...

You can do it for free in Spain in most places. People will think you weird or drunk if you do it in the middle of a city though. In any case, the best places, especially the ones close to other commodities, will probably be paid for, simply because everybody would want to be there at the same time and that's not possible.


you can't really find "good quality" grass

Maintaining lawn requires somebody's time and effort, and it rarely grows so nicely in cities because they are full of people, pollution, and scum. It's only normal you'd have to pay for it, that guy has to buy food too, and he will want to relax in this way or another with his well earned money.


which you have to pay for to get there too

The resources necessary to go somewhere took and take time and effort to make, maintain, and transport. Like I said, they won't do this for you out of charity, because that wouldn't be fair. Just like you won't work 8 hours a day for free.

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IRT HK: it's redicilous that how much costs everything

I agree that some things are too expensive for what they are worth (you're usually free not to buy these), but every time you buy something, think how many hours of human work it took to do. These people have to eat too.

<font color="#345E81" size="1">[ March 22, 2005 02:48 PM: Message edited by: -Wiseman- ]</font>

[mrwiseman]

Hungary is one of the most expensive countries

Really? Interesting.

How much do these cost in Hungary? [Spanish prices in brackets]

● Food: Individual pizza in an Italian restaurant in Budapest [Madrid: 5.9 ?]
● Clothes: Average non-Levis jeans [25 ?]
● Equipment: A good quality plastic garden chair [6 ?]
● Electroncis: PS2 PSTwo model without games or memory cards [147 ?]
● Resources: Electricity (1 KW/h) [0.09 ?]
● Transportation: One-way ticket for a train covering a 20 Km distance [1.15 ?]
● Property: 85 m? flat in a middle class neighborhood of Budapest [Madrid: 320000 ?]
● Taxes: Value Added Tax (VAT, in %) [16%]
● Salaries: Average yearly salary an average IT professional with a non-Ph.D. university degree may earn in his/her first job [18000 ?]

Spain has, except for property, relatively low prices and salaries. Even though it varies from region to region, the average Spaniard can buy as much as the average French, and a little more than the average Italian.

<font color="#345E81" size="1">[ March 22, 2005 04:42 PM: Message edited by: -Wiseman- ]</font>

[Xellos]

I like having money, makes things easier, but it's not top priority for me. As long as I make enouhg to keep whatever family I'll have happ,y that's fine.

[Hell Knight]

Irt Wise: I hope you can wait a few days till I reply on that, cause donno these immediately, and I don't travel to Budapest too often though it's not far from here

[mrwiseman]

Sure, don't worry, I was just curious

[Cataferal]

It might be a little hard to measure the prices of some of those. Like the average pizza for instance.

[Nevan]

Money makes me happy, because of the stuff you can get with money. But money isn't the only thing that makes me happy. Money is all powerful in today's society, to get food and shelter it is a must. Money causes problems, however, but then again what doesn't? Food causes problems since it keeps criminals alive, but it is a must.

Money, it's a hit.

[Dreamer7000]

I mean nowdays, we need money for everything that exists... okay not air, so almost everything.
A few examples:
In some places, you have to pay to enter a beautiful park, to have a picnic or whatever.
You can only have food if you buy it... anyone ever saw a hungry man who was happy?

Ofcourse, not everything can be buyed with money, but it do makes me happier when I have some to spend... People can be also happy by love, the friends around him/her, or even only because the sun is shining...
Contra to that, even you buy these little presents (if you don't make them yourselves... which also needs stuff you can only buy, so the circle goes...) for your loved ones on occasions, to actually make them happy.
And ofcourse, even a good word or a Happy whatever will replace this, and make me happy, but everyone is happy if they recieve or can give presents.
Without money, we could live happily, but that also would be primitive. But now, if you'd like a game for example, you have to pay the maker company, the workers there etc. &gt;&gt;&gt; they recieve your money and be able to buy food (again) or whatever, and be happy...
This is the huge circle... do you feel my point?
I think money is essential to be happy in this world...

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